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Wonderland cancelled?

  • I read someone's comment (on Facebook maybe) saying Wonderland had been cancelled, but I couldn't find any confirmation. Anybody know anything?

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    • I don't think there's confirmation, but it certainly seems likely.

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    • I sure hope not.

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    • I hope not/...

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    • Don't think so. Not yet anyways :L

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    • Last episode was the loser of the night according to the ratings, if this keeps happening that might be the show's fate. The good thing is that according to the creators Wonderland story will wrap up  at the end of the season whether the show gets cancelled or not.

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    • I don't think so... If it was the case, we would know it. But the show is likely to be cancelled very soon, because of the terrible ratings...

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    • I am sure it will at least finish the season. I don't really think ABC is expecting this show to perform wonders (get it). I mean, the competition is The X Factor and The Big Bang Theory which together get anywhere from 25-30 million viewers a night. At least Wonderland is performing on par with the shows from the two other networks. I think it was so foolish of ABC to try and be "clever" by putting this show in a competitive timeslot they always have had trouble with. They should have moved "Revenge" up to 10:00 on sundays and put Wonderland on at 9 right after OUAT.

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    • I don't think it's cancelled but the show won't last for too long, its ratings are terrible. Original idea of making this show as a fill-in for original series was much better option imo. It would probably have a way better ratings and perhaps it would survive for at least another season. 

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    • If they want to keep it the best chance they have is to move the show to other night because right now it can't stand thursday competition, maybe it can perform better in a different night.

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    • I really hope they will be able to finish airing this season... It wouldn't be respectful for the fans to cancel it now...

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    • I don't mind if it gets canceled after the first season.

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    • Fan de Lost wrote:
      I really hope they will be able to finish airing this season... It wouldn't be respectful for the fans to cancel it now...

      Dis. I hate when stories don't finish D:

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    • Don't worry even if they don't finish the story, writers will manage to give a closure in OUAT, but they have said that won't be necessary, this season will wrap up in the season finale.

      Besides I believe that if the show is not renewed these characters will return or will have a cameo in OUAT anyways.

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    • Maybe at the end the Knave will wish to return to Storybrooke along with Alice, Cyrus and Anastasia.

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    • I agree with Rinkai. Once OUAT;W wrapped up, I am hoping that the characters will show up on the original OUAT.

      I really like the idea that at the season finale of OUAT:W, Alice and Cyrus will find their happy ending and then Jafar and Red QAueen find their way to crossover to original Ouat and beomces the new villain for season 4 of OuAT.

      I think it will be a swell idea. Plus at this time maybe PrinceEric expeidition to Agravah can be explored. 

      And oh yeah, I still want to see Regina b*tchslap Anastasia.

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    • Teehee.heehee.9 wrote:
      I agree with Rinkai. Once OUAT;W wrapped up, I am hoping that the characters will show up on the original OUAT.

      I really like the idea that at the season finale of OUAT:W, Alice and Cyrus will find their happy ending and then Jafar and Red QAueen find their way to crossover to original Ouat and beomces the new villain for season 4 of OuAT.

      I think it will be a swell idea. Plus at this time maybe PrinceEric expeidition to Agravah can be explored. 

      And oh yeah, I still want to see Regina b*tchslap Anastasia.

      Agree with pretty much all of dis

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    • I think these characters will indeed appear in OUAT. But to me, the real question is if ABC will get them a chance to finish the thirteen episodes... I hope it does...

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    • Maybe the characters will appear in OUAT, but I think they won't be the new villains of season 4 or something like that... I think they won't be the main characters of the story, maybe they gonna play a part in OUAT, but not as principal characters...

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      Fan de Lost wrote:
      I really hope they will be able to finish airing this season... It wouldn't be respectful for the fans to cancel it now...
      Dis. I hate when stories don't finish D:

      I agree with you both. But any of you remember of that alien series on ABC that was cancelled abruptly? That remake? The name escapes me right now. I WAS so pissed...

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    • It's a shame the show will be cancelled. :(

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    • QuinnHeartly wrote:
      It's a shame the show will be cancelled. :(

      What? Is this confirmed now?

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      QuinnHeartly wrote:
      It's a shame the show will be cancelled. :(
      What? Is this confirmed now?

      No. As of now, the show is not canceled. 

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    • I bet ABC is just gonna let the 13 episodes play out then cancel it which is a shame because its actually becoming a really good show.

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    • But why would they cancel it in the first place?

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    • Titanicman95 wrote:
      But why would they cancel it in the first place?

      Its' ratings and views :3

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    • YayMona wrote:
      I bet ABC is just gonna let the 13 episodes play out then cancel it which is a shame because its actually becoming a really good show.

      This is my hope, that at least they'll do this.

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    • it is just getting better....

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    • Arctucrus wrote:

      Titanicman95 wrote:
      But why would they cancel it in the first place?

      Its' ratings and views :3

      But why does everyone trust the rating? The stupid critics never like anything and wouldn't know a good movie or tv show when they saw one. True I am easy to please. But still. Why trust the ratings? and I thought it is already getting thousands of views?

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    • Titanicman95 wrote:

      But why does everyone trust the rating? The stupid critics never like anything and wouldn't know a good movie or tv show when they saw one. True I am easy to please. But still. Why trust the ratings? and I thought it is already getting thousands of views?

      Rating have nothing to with critics, it refers to viewership. If a show does not have good ratings, the network looses money. TV shows cost a lot, to produce. If the ratings are bad, no one will want to air commercials.

      OUaTiW has terrible ratings.... as in, The CW bad.

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    • So not many people are watching OUATW? How do they know how many people are watching?

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    • Titanicman95 wrote:
      So not many people are watching OUATW? How do they know how many people are watching?

      The television networks and cable/satellite providers can track, when people are watching live or recording onto DVR.

      By the way, how old are you?

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    • How many people are watching Once Upon a Time in Wonderland? If they do cancel it, will they find a way to rap up the story?

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    • Titanicman95 wrote:
      How many people are watching Once Upon a Time in Wonderland? If they do cancel it, will they find a way to rap up the story?

      I believe, the ratings average 3.5 million.... I could be wrong.

      OUaTiW was conceived as a self-contained mini-series. It was only ever going to have 13-16 episodes. This is probably the reason, it has not been cancelled yet. It is just unlikely the show will be renewed, for a second season.

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    • They have over a million viewers, to me that does not give a reason for canceling.

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    • Titanicman95 wrote:
      They have over a million viewers, to me that does not give a reason for canceling.

      3.5 million is incredibly low, for a network like ABC.... this is not The CW.

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    • Then would be considered high?

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    • Titanicman95 wrote:
      Then would be considered high?

      10 million and up.

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    • Even if they do cancel it, will they find a way rap up the story?

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    • Titanicman95 wrote:
      Even if they do cancel it, will they find a way rap up the story?

      I will repeat.... OUaTiW was conceived as a self-contained mini-series. It was only ever going to have 13-16 episodes. This is probably the reason, it has not been cancelled yet. It is just unlikely the show will be renewed, for a second season.

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    • ok

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    • I think it's good that OUaTiW was only ever intended as a mini-series and that we'll get closure at the end. I hope that ABC considers running another OAaT mini-series. OUaTiW is what drew me into the fandom in the first place, and maybe future mini-series like it will also increase viewership of the original series. :)

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    • i just really hope that we will see Jafar and Red Queen again in OuAT as came or as new villain.  Today's episoe "Wh's ALice" actually has a very good dialogue and lately I have been intrigued by OuAT:W more than OuAT. I guess because I am so tired of CHarming cloyingly happy ending love.  ITonight I was intensely await for yet another cameo but one...oh well lets see...

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    • I'm hoping that we see Jafar turn into the giant snake.

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    • Autumndandelion wrote:
      I think it's good that OUaTiW was only ever intended as a mini-series and that we'll get closure at the end. I hope that ABC considers running another OAaT mini-series. OUaTiW is what drew me into the fandom in the first place, and maybe future mini-series like it will also increase viewership of the original series. :)

      This was my exact thought from the beginning. Each spin off mini series can be one season, but collectlivly be a whole series. A Once Upon A Time Worlds series, if you will. Meanwhile, the main show continues on with it's own stuff. Of course, characters and places can crossover at times for a more complete canon. As for what I would think would make other good "Worlds" seasons: Once Upon A Time in Oz, Once Upon A Time in Narnia, Once Upon A Time in Prydain, Once Upon A Time in Middle Earth, just to name a few.

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote:
      Autumndandelion wrote:
      I think it's good that OUaTiW was only ever intended as a mini-series and that we'll get closure at the end. I hope that ABC considers running another OAaT mini-series. OUaTiW is what drew me into the fandom in the first place, and maybe future mini-series like it will also increase viewership of the original series. :)
      This was my exact thought from the beginning. Each spin off mini series can be one season, but collectlivly be a whole series. A Once Upon A Time Worlds series, if you will. Meanwhile, the main show continues on with it's own stuff. Of course, characters and places can crossover at times for a more complete canon. As for what I would think would make other good "Worlds" seasons: Once Upon A Time in Oz, Once Upon A Time in Narnia, Once Upon A Time in Prydain, Once Upon A Time in Middle Earth, just to name a few.

      I'm not familiar with Prydain, but I disagree with Narnia and Middle Earth. Those stories are so complete on their own, and plus I disagree with them being quite classics in the same sense as everything else on the show...I'd just rather not see them on OUaT.

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    • Arctucrus wrote:

      I'm not familiar with Prydain, but I disagree with Narnia and Middle Earth. 

      Prydain, is what Disney's The Black Cauldron is based on.... I think.

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    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      Arctucrus wrote:

      I'm not familiar with Prydain, but I disagree with Narnia and Middle Earth. 

      Prydain, is what Disney's The Black Cauldron is based on.... I think.

      Still not familiar :P Thanks though!

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    • I can see Narnia as an existing world in the OUaT universe. I would love a mention. But I seriously think (and hope) they'll never actually show Narnia.

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      Autumndandelion wrote:
      I think it's good that OUaTiW was only ever intended as a mini-series and that we'll get closure at the end. I hope that ABC considers running another OAaT mini-series. OUaTiW is what drew me into the fandom in the first place, and maybe future mini-series like it will also increase viewership of the original series. :)
      This was my exact thought from the beginning. Each spin off mini series can be one season, but collectlivly be a whole series. A Once Upon A Time Worlds series, if you will. Meanwhile, the main show continues on with it's own stuff. Of course, characters and places can crossover at times for a more complete canon. As for what I would think would make other good "Worlds" seasons: Once Upon A Time in Oz, Once Upon A Time in Narnia, Once Upon A Time in Prydain, Once Upon A Time in Middle Earth, just to name a few.
      I'm not familiar with Prydain, but I disagree with Narnia and Middle Earth. Those stories are so complete on their own, and plus I disagree with them being quite classics in the same sense as everything else on the show...I'd just rather not see them on OUaT.

      And Oz and Wonderland are incomplete? Oz has 14 books written about it by the original author (L. Frank Baum). Also, I think C. S. Lewis and J. R. R. Toliken would be insulted to have their imensly popular works not considered "classic". Finally, as Choc wrote, Prydain is what The Black Cauldron is based on, although in truth it is a series of 5 books called The Chronicals of Prydain, and The Black Cauldron is just a mash up on the first two books (The second of which is called The Black Cauldron), and, as you can probably suspect the books are far superior to the movie.

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote:

      Also, I think C. S. Lewis and J. R. R. Toliken would be insulted to have their imensly popular works not considered "classic". 

      I can also see C.S. Lewis and J.R.R. Tolkien being offended, by OUaT butchering their masterpieces. OUaT is great, but they should not touch Narnia and Middle-Earth.

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    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:

      Also, I think C. S. Lewis and J. R. R. Toliken would be insulted to have their imensly popular works not considered "classic". 

      I can also see C.S. Lewis and J.R.R. Tolkien being offended, by OUaT butchering their masterpieces. OUaT is great, but they should not touch Narnia and Middle-Earth.

      So The Brothers Grimm, L. Frank Baum, Carol Lewis, etc. wrote what? Crap? Again, not seeing how one fantasy author wrote an untouchable masterpiece and another's should be fodder for everyone to mess with.

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote:
      Arctucrus wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      Autumndandelion wrote:
      I think it's good that OUaTiW was only ever intended as a mini-series and that we'll get closure at the end. I hope that ABC considers running another OAaT mini-series. OUaTiW is what drew me into the fandom in the first place, and maybe future mini-series like it will also increase viewership of the original series. :)
      This was my exact thought from the beginning. Each spin off mini series can be one season, but collectlivly be a whole series. A Once Upon A Time Worlds series, if you will. Meanwhile, the main show continues on with it's own stuff. Of course, characters and places can crossover at times for a more complete canon. As for what I would think would make other good "Worlds" seasons: Once Upon A Time in Oz, Once Upon A Time in Narnia, Once Upon A Time in Prydain, Once Upon A Time in Middle Earth, just to name a few.
      I'm not familiar with Prydain, but I disagree with Narnia and Middle Earth. Those stories are so complete on their own, and plus I disagree with them being quite classics in the same sense as everything else on the show...I'd just rather not see them on OUaT.
      And Oz and Wonderland are incomplete? Oz has 14 books written about it by the original author (L. Frank Baum). Also, I think C. S. Lewis and J. R. R. Toliken would be insulted to have their imensly popular works not considered "classic". Finally, as Choc wrote, Prydain is what The Black Cauldron is based on, although in truth it is a series of 5 books called The Chronicals of Prydain, and The Black Cauldron is just a mash up on the first two books (The second of which is called The Black Cauldron), and, as you can probably suspect the books are far superior to the movie.

      I don't appreciate others claiming me to have said something different from what I said, especially when they try to claim I insulted someone when I didn't.

      Read more carefully next time please.

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      Arctucrus wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      Autumndandelion wrote:
      I think it's good that OUaTiW was only ever intended as a mini-series and that we'll get closure at the end. I hope that ABC considers running another OAaT mini-series. OUaTiW is what drew me into the fandom in the first place, and maybe future mini-series like it will also increase viewership of the original series. :)
      This was my exact thought from the beginning. Each spin off mini series can be one season, but collectlivly be a whole series. A Once Upon A Time Worlds series, if you will. Meanwhile, the main show continues on with it's own stuff. Of course, characters and places can crossover at times for a more complete canon. As for what I would think would make other good "Worlds" seasons: Once Upon A Time in Oz, Once Upon A Time in Narnia, Once Upon A Time in Prydain, Once Upon A Time in Middle Earth, just to name a few.
      I'm not familiar with Prydain, but I disagree with Narnia and Middle Earth. Those stories are so complete on their own, and plus I disagree with them being quite classics in the same sense as everything else on the show...I'd just rather not see them on OUaT.
      And Oz and Wonderland are incomplete? Oz has 14 books written about it by the original author (L. Frank Baum). Also, I think C. S. Lewis and J. R. R. Toliken would be insulted to have their imensly popular works not considered "classic". Finally, as Choc wrote, Prydain is what The Black Cauldron is based on, although in truth it is a series of 5 books called The Chronicals of Prydain, and The Black Cauldron is just a mash up on the first two books (The second of which is called The Black Cauldron), and, as you can probably suspect the books are far superior to the movie.
      I don't appreciate others claiming me to have said something different from what I said, especially when they try to claim I insulted someone when I didn't.

      Read more carefully next time please.

      And ignoring that you have the word "classics" literally one word in front of where you bolded is also not appreciated. If you wanted to be understood you should explain why you don't see them working, rather than "I'd just rather not see them on OUaT". Let me see, did I read that right?

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    • Please, stop arguing.

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    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      Please, stop arguing.

      Yes, sorry about that, I just get annoyed when people try to make it like I didn't read what they said. On an unrealted note, but related to the thread topic, with that Wonderland cliffhanger, I'm kind of hoping it does get more than 5 to 8 more episodes, it seems like the show keeps gaining momentum and potiental the longer it goes!

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    • Similarly to how I don't appreciate people putting words in my mouth, I don't appreciate people pinning things on me I didn't do. I didn't ignore the word "classic" and I didn't highlight it because it wasn't part of my point. It seems you're so fixated on attacking me out of some stupid childish need, you missed it. Allow me to illustrate it for you.

      My point was that they aren't classics in the same sense as everything else on the show. That was my point. Seeing as the part you originally missed was my calling them classics, but the word "classic" itself was present, I was able to infer that you missed how I called them classics-not in the same sense as everything else on the show, hence why that was highlighted.

      Now as to why I don't want them on the show, therein lies your reason: They aren't classics in the same sense as everything else on the show.

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      Similarly to how I don't appreciate people putting words in my mouth, I don't appreciate people pinning things on me I didn't do. I didn't ignore the word "classic" and I didn't highlight it because it wasn't part of my point. It seems you're so fixated on attacking me out of some stupid childish need, you missed it. Allow me to illustrate it for you.

      My point was that they aren't classics in the same sense as everything else on the show. That was my point. Seeing as the part you originally missed was my calling them classics, but the word "classic" itself was present, I was able to infer that you missed how I called them classics-not in the same sense as everything else on the show, hence why that was highlighted.

      Now as to why I don't want them on the show, therein lies your reason: They aren't classics in the same sense as everything else on the show.

      Wow, not only is that a faulty argument/reason (and here is why: How can you say Chinese myths, European folktales, Ancient Greek Mythology, children's novels by an English fellow, and a fantasy horror novel are all the same kind of classic, but some different fantasy novels are not? That doesn't make any sense), I also find it ironic how you are complaining about me missing things, when you clearly missed someone telling us to stop, me appologizing, and me moving on and trying to get the thread back on topic. Now who's childish?

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    • You guys are doing it again.... so, please stop!

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    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      You guys are doing it again.... so, please stop!

      I second this

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    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      You guys are doing it again.... so, please stop!

      I attempted to stop, from now on I will just ignore any more comments. Anyway, does anybody agree with me that Wonderland could go for more that 5 to 8 more episodes? Or should they just wrap up the loose ends and maybe use some of the characters as guest stars on the main show sometimes?

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    • I am all for the next season.

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    • The Ancient Greek Mythology is a bit of an exception, and arguably the Chinese myths, but really, they're far more similar to the rest that is on the show than Narnia and Middle Earth.

      Narnia and Middle Earth's storylines are very well defined. They have one clear source-the original authors. There's the books they wrote and the movies adapted directly from the books (allow me to emphasize that the movies try to, within their reasonable limitations, tell the exact same stories as the books), there's not really any new and different versions that are as culturally ingrained as the originals. With everything else on the show, however, there's already a vast quantity of different versions out there, some even more famous than the originals. 

      With Narnia and Middle Earth, everyone sticks to the originals. With everything else, they are far more culturally ingrained in the sense that people twist them all the time, tell different versions, etc. 

      That's how I can say they're a different kind of classic. Make sense? :)

      Funny, this time you took the words right out of my mouth! Yes, I missed someone telling us to stop because I hadn't reloaded the page, so I didn't see that until after I posted my post and you posted the response I'm responding to now, pointing it out-which was when I went and saw it. ;)

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    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      You guys are doing it again.... so, please stop!

      He asked a legitimate question this time: "How can you say...are the same kind of classic, and not...?"

      I was just clearing it up.

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote:

      Anyway, does anybody agree with me that Wonderland could go for more that 5 to 8 more episodes? Or should they just wrap up the loose ends and maybe use some of the characters as guest stars on the main show sometimes?

      If OUaTiW gets cancelled, whether it finishes its season or not, the characters should not crossover to the mother show.

      There are many reasons, the spinoff is not performng well. One of them, is its characters. They are not as compelling, as the ones on OUaT. It would turn off a lot of viewers. They would feel like.... the spinoff failed, so why are these characters being forced onto us again?

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      You guys are doing it again.... so, please stop!
      I attempted to stop, from now on I will just ignore any more comments. Anyway, does anybody agree with me that Wonderland could go for more that 5 to 8 more episodes? Or should they just wrap up the loose ends and maybe use some of the characters as guest stars on the main show sometimes?

      I'm enjoying the quality of the show now, and that it's built up to something almost equally as spectacular as the main show, I do like it, and I like it a lot more than I did in the beginning. However, as to whether or not it should continue for more than another 5 to 8 more episodes...I don't know yet. I have to see the ending of the show to decide if I think there's more that could be done or not, and I could very easily think there's nothing left to do even if I love the ending.

      However, either way, I very much support the idea of seeing the main characters of OUaTiW on OUaT. Especially if the show ends after the one season.

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      The Ancient Greek Mythology is a bit of an exception, and arguably the Chinese myths, but really, they're far more similar to the rest that is on the show than Narnia and Middle Earth.

      Narnia and Middle Earth's storylines are very well defined. They have one clear source-the original authors. There's the books they wrote and the movies adapted directly from the books (allow me to emphasize that the movies try to, within their reasonable limitations, tell the exact same stories as the books), there's not really any new and different versions that are as culturally ingrained as the originals. With everything else on the show, however, there's already a vast quantity of different versions out there, some even more famous than the originals. 

      With Narnia and Middle Earth, everyone sticks to the originals. With everything else, they are far more culturally ingrained in the sense that people twist them all the time, tell different versions, etc. 

      That's how I can say they're a different kind of classic. Make sense? :)

      Funny, this time you took the words right out of my mouth! Yes, I missed someone telling us to stop because I hadn't reloaded the page, so I didn't see that until after I posted my post and you posted the response I'm responding to now, pointing it out-which was when I went and saw it. ;)

      Yes, thank you for a reasonable thought out reason(s) for why you wouldn't want to see them, now I understand. The only conter-argument to your reason I have would be that the reason people haven't done their own take on Middle Earth or Narnia yet is because these books are newer than everything else that has been covered so far. Eventually, people are going to make other stories, etc. about these beloved worlds, and I, for one, would be more than happy to see Eddy and Adam be one of the first to do it.

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    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:

      Anyway, does anybody agree with me that Wonderland could go for more that 5 to 8 more episodes? Or should they just wrap up the loose ends and maybe use some of the characters as guest stars on the main show sometimes?

      If OUaTiW gets cancelled, whether it finishes its season or not, the characters should not crossover to the mother show.

      There are many reasons, the spinoff is not performng well. One of them, is its characters. They are not as compelling, as the ones on OUaT. It would turn off a lot of viewers. They would feel like.... the spinoff failed, so why are these characters being forced onto us again?

      From what I've seen people do seem to like at least one, if not multiple, characters of the main cast. Maybe you are an exception to that, but I don't think it would bother people if we saw Jafar or Alice in one or two Once episodes. Furthermore, what ABC's rating department and what viewers consider a failure are two completly different things. One more thought, I think alot of people don't want to watch spinoff shows, if they are already behind on (or haven't watched) the main show. I know of several people in my own life that like Once and want to try the spinoff, but are already behind on the main show, and so don't want to watch the spinoff right now.

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote:
      Arctucrus wrote:
      The Ancient Greek Mythology is a bit of an exception, and arguably the Chinese myths, but really, they're far more similar to the rest that is on the show than Narnia and Middle Earth.

      Narnia and Middle Earth's storylines are very well defined. They have one clear source-the original authors. There's the books they wrote and the movies adapted directly from the books (allow me to emphasize that the movies try to, within their reasonable limitations, tell the exact same stories as the books), there's not really any new and different versions that are as culturally ingrained as the originals. With everything else on the show, however, there's already a vast quantity of different versions out there, some even more famous than the originals. 

      With Narnia and Middle Earth, everyone sticks to the originals. With everything else, they are far more culturally ingrained in the sense that people twist them all the time, tell different versions, etc. 

      That's how I can say they're a different kind of classic. Make sense? :)

      Funny, this time you took the words right out of my mouth! Yes, I missed someone telling us to stop because I hadn't reloaded the page, so I didn't see that until after I posted my post and you posted the response I'm responding to now, pointing it out-which was when I went and saw it. ;)

      Yes, thank you for a reasonable thought out reason(s) for why you wouldn't want to see them, now I understand. The only conter-argument to your reason I have would be that the reason people haven't done their own take on Middle Earth or Narnia yet is because these books are newer than everything else that has been covered so far. Eventually, people are going to make other stories, etc. about these beloved worlds, and I, for one, would be more than happy to see Eddy and Adam be one of the first to do it.

      No problem, all you had to do was ask in the first place. Tends to get people further than a pointless attack ;)

      Now, as far as them being newer, you call that a counter-argument, but I disagree, I see that as even more support for why they shouldn't be touched on OUaT. The fact that they're newer only sets them apart further from everything else on OUaT, therefore they are only more different, and therefore that is only more reason not to touch them. IMO.

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      Arctucrus wrote:
      The Ancient Greek Mythology is a bit of an exception, and arguably the Chinese myths, but really, they're far more similar to the rest that is on the show than Narnia and Middle Earth.

      Narnia and Middle Earth's storylines are very well defined. They have one clear source-the original authors. There's the books they wrote and the movies adapted directly from the books (allow me to emphasize that the movies try to, within their reasonable limitations, tell the exact same stories as the books), there's not really any new and different versions that are as culturally ingrained as the originals. With everything else on the show, however, there's already a vast quantity of different versions out there, some even more famous than the originals. 

      With Narnia and Middle Earth, everyone sticks to the originals. With everything else, they are far more culturally ingrained in the sense that people twist them all the time, tell different versions, etc. 

      That's how I can say they're a different kind of classic. Make sense? :)

      Funny, this time you took the words right out of my mouth! Yes, I missed someone telling us to stop because I hadn't reloaded the page, so I didn't see that until after I posted my post and you posted the response I'm responding to now, pointing it out-which was when I went and saw it. ;)

      Yes, thank you for a reasonable thought out reason(s) for why you wouldn't want to see them, now I understand. The only conter-argument to your reason I have would be that the reason people haven't done their own take on Middle Earth or Narnia yet is because these books are newer than everything else that has been covered so far. Eventually, people are going to make other stories, etc. about these beloved worlds, and I, for one, would be more than happy to see Eddy and Adam be one of the first to do it.
      No problem, all you had to do was ask in the first place. Tends to get people further than a pointless attack ;)

      Now, as far as them being newer, you call that a counter-argument, but I disagree, I see that as even more support for why they shouldn't be touched on OUaT. The fact that they're newer only sets them apart further from everything else on OUaT, therefore they are only more different, and therefore that is only more reason not to touch them. IMO.

      That brings up an interesting conundrum though, when are people allowed to touch "classic works of fiction"? 50 years after they were written? 100 years? Only after the author is dead? I see your point if we are talking about Harry Potter, the oldest book was first published in 1996 (less than 20 years ago), the author is still living, the movies just recently finished up, and the author is still adding additional info on Pottermore. But Narnia and Middle Earth are quite a bit older than this (I believe they were written in the 50's and 60's) and their authors are already dead. Why are Oz and Wonderland (written around 1900 if I recall correctly) ready and Narnia and Middle Earth not? I am interested to see how you answer this.

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      You guys are doing it again.... so, please stop!
      I attempted to stop, from now on I will just ignore any more comments. Anyway, does anybody agree with me that Wonderland could go for more that 5 to 8 more episodes? Or should they just wrap up the loose ends and maybe use some of the characters as guest stars on the main show sometimes?
      I'm enjoying the quality of the show now, and that it's built up to something almost equally as spectacular as the main show, I do like it, and I like it a lot more than I did in the beginning. However, as to whether or not it should continue for more than another 5 to 8 more episodes...I don't know yet. I have to see the ending of the show to decide if I think there's more that could be done or not, and I could very easily think there's nothing left to do even if I love the ending.

      However, either way, I very much support the idea of seeing the main characters of OUaTiW on OUaT. Especially if the show ends after the one season.

      I agree a lot with this, it is very well said. :) It is also why I mentioned the thought of a Once Upon A Time Worlds series earlier today, which is, funnily enough what we are now discussing, which worlds should and should not qualify.

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    • The answer to that lies in one of my other posts.

      It's the fact that all the stories on Once Upon a Time have already been touched, added to, modified, had different versions created, etc. while Middle Earth and Narnia's stories have not. In other words, to me, Once Upon a Time has been about a new, fresh and exciting take on all the stories we've already heard 1,000 different times, 1,000 different ways. Middle Earth and Narnia's stories simply don't fit that yet. 

      To answer your question, "What makes them ready?", I don't know. I have no clue. I don't think anybody does. Now, as to finding out whether or not they are ready, I'm completely open to that. I just don't think OUaT is the way to find out if they're ready. I don't support it being the way. 

      TL;DR, I just think OUaT is about the stories that we know are ready, not about the ones that we need to find out if they are.

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote: From what I've seen people do seem to like at least one, if not multiple, characters of the main cast. Maybe you are an exception to that, but I don't think it would bother people if we saw Jafar or Alice in one or two Once episodes. Furthermore, what ABC's rating department and what viewers consider a failure are two completly different things. One more thought, I think alot of people don't want to watch spinoff shows, if they are already behind on (or haven't watched) the main show. I know of several people in my own life that like Once and want to try the spinoff, but are already behind on the main show, and so don't want to watch the spinoff right now.

      People who don't watch the spin-off won't want to see characters from a failed show on the show that's still running, as I've pointed out before.

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    • Utter solitude wrote:

      CoolDudeAl wrote: From what I've seen people do seem to like at least one, if not multiple, characters of the main cast. Maybe you are an exception to that, but I don't think it would bother people if we saw Jafar or Alice in one or two Once episodes. Furthermore, what ABC's rating department and what viewers consider a failure are two completly different things. One more thought, I think alot of people don't want to watch spinoff shows, if they are already behind on (or haven't watched) the main show. I know of several people in my own life that like Once and want to try the spinoff, but are already behind on the main show, and so don't want to watch the spinoff right now.

      People who don't want the spin-off won't want to see characters from a failed show on the show that's still running, as I've pointed out before.

      But that's my point: Are their any Once fans, that aren't watching the spinoff show, and at least like one of the characters? I don't think there really is. Also, I'm not proposing to add them to the main cast. I know you've said you don't care for the Blue Fairy, yet you've been able to watch and enjoy Once, and she's been in 18 episodes. I am merely suggesting a guest role for them on an occational episode, when it would support the main cast. It would be no worse for you or anyone else than you having to watch an episode with the Blue Fairy in it.

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    • Arctucrus wrote:
      The answer to that lies in one of my other posts.

      It's the fact that all the stories on Once Upon a Time have already been touched, added to, modified, had different versions created, etc. while Middle Earth and Narnia's stories have not. In other words, to me, Once Upon a Time has been about a new, fresh and exciting take on all the stories we've already heard 1,000 different times, 1,000 different ways. Middle Earth and Narnia's stories simply don't fit that yet. 

      To answer your question, "What makes them ready?", I don't know. I have no clue. I don't think anybody does. Now, as to finding out whether or not they are ready, I'm completely open to that. I just don't think OUaT is the way to find out if they're ready. I don't support it being the way. 

      TL;DR, I just think OUaT is about the stories that we know are ready, not about the ones that we need to find out if they are.

      That's a fair point. I wonder though if Once doesn't do it, than who will? I am eager to see a fresh take on these stories, and since Once is doing classic stories that's why I thought it would be a good fit. Of course this whole debate may be useless, compared to the bigger issue: Even if Adam and Eddy wanted to do Narnia or Middle Earth, would they be able to get the rights?

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote:

      But that's my point: Are their any Once fans, that aren't watching the spinoff show, and at least like one of the characters? I don't think there really is.

      I watched the first few episodes of OUATIW but it doesn't hold the same appeal for me that the regular show does. I might also be bias because I've never been a fan of Alice in Wonderland in any form. My exception - and the reason I initially gave Wonderland a shot - was because I liked Jefferson. (I could've done without Grace, but I liked Jefferson.)

      I also adored how they brought Jafar into things, but the Alice/Cyrus thing is pretty dull. (And no, I don't ship Alice/Knave either.) I've been waiting for news of Jasmine appearing or flashbacks of Anastasia being revealed as Cinderella's step-sister. If either of those happen, I might pick up the episodes again.

      I definitely wouldn't mind Jafar coming to OUAT though. (Still hoping Jasmine will show up, aside from the Easter Egg at Eric's ball.) Or possibly even Anastasia, if it involves Ashley/Cinderella. But I'm not interested in seeing Alice and/or Cyrus. Even though I'm supposed to root for their love story, they only make me yawn.

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote: But that's my point: Are their any Once fans, that aren't watching the spinoff show, and at least like one of the characters? I don't think there really is. Also, I'm not proposing to add them to the main cast. I know you've said you don't care for the Blue Fairy, yet you've been able to watch and enjoy Once, and she's been in 18 episodes. I am merely suggesting a guest role for them on an occational episode, when it would support the main cast. It would be no worse for you or anyone else than you having to watch an episode with the Blue Fairy in it.

      You're missing my point (The BF isn't from a failed show, btw)

      Of course there's fans of the show not watching the spin off, lol. I've been speaking from a purely out-of-context standpoint; if something fails, it's generally not good to inject something that failed into something else, ya know? XD

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    • Mewiet wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:

      But that's my point: Are their any Once fans, that aren't watching the spinoff show, and at least like one of the characters? I don't think there really is.

      I watched the first few episodes of OUATIW but it doesn't hold the same appeal for me that the regular show does. I might also be bias because I've never been a fan of Alice in Wonderland in any form. My exception - and the reason I initially gave Wonderland a shot - was because I liked Jefferson. (I could've done without Grace, but I liked Jefferson.)

      I also adored how they brought Jafar into things, but the Alice/Cyrus thing is pretty dull. (And no, I don't ship Alice/Knave either.) I've been waiting for news of Jasmine appearing or flashbacks of Anastasia being revealed as Cinderella's step-sister. If either of those happen, I might pick up the episodes again.

      I definitely wouldn't mind Jafar coming to OUAT though. (Still hoping Jasmine will show up, aside from the Easter Egg at Eric's ball.) Or possibly even Anastasia, if it involves Ashley/Cinderella. But I'm not interested in seeing Alice and/or Cyrus. Even though I'm supposed to root for their love story, they only make me yawn.

      Yeah, I would say if you don't like any form of Alice and Wonderland, this show won't be your favorite, they have minor Wonderland characters, they have word puns, they have everything you would love (or not love) in Wonderland. I do think it helps to have things like Jafar and the Knave being Will Scarlett, though. And yes I can see your point about Alice and Cyrus, they are a bit sicknely sweet, but again they are not the whole show. I also think it you should try to push through and watch the episodes, if you like Once because 1. Like it or not this is part of the canon, 2. I am sure they will cross reference stuff from this show to the main one, even if it is Easter Egg-y, and 3. You'd be suprised how much of the show is about Will (the Knave), Anastasia, and Jafar, about half of the flashbacks are completly about them, showing they are just as important as Alice and Cyrus. And I don't know how many episodes you watched, but I feel the show keeps getting better each week, aka the first few episodes were necceary set up, but not the best, plot wise.

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    • Utter solitude wrote:

      CoolDudeAl wrote: But that's my point: Are their any Once fans, that aren't watching the spinoff show, and at least like one of the characters? I don't think there really is. Also, I'm not proposing to add them to the main cast. I know you've said you don't care for the Blue Fairy, yet you've been able to watch and enjoy Once, and she's been in 18 episodes. I am merely suggesting a guest role for them on an occational episode, when it would support the main cast. It would be no worse for you or anyone else than you having to watch an episode with the Blue Fairy in it.

      You're missing my point (The BF isn't from a failed show, btw)

      Of course there's fans of the show not watching the spin off, lol. I've been speaking from a purely out-of-context standpoint; if something fails, it's generally not good to inject something that failed into something else, ya know? XD

      Maybe my problem is I don't understand to whom this show failed. Are you talking about to ABC's rating department, are you talking about critics, are you talking about fans of the main show, are you talking about people who like Alice and Wonderland as a book, I don't know. If we're talking ratings, I don't think spinoffs ever get as high a rating as the show they spun off from, and I'm not suprised it's not doing as well there. If we're talking about fans of the main show, as I said, some of them haven't even tried it, and it seems the people who have and continue to follow it, that for the most part, are liking it more and more each week. Every story starts off slow as a lot of expostion has to get done, characters have to be introduced, etc. before you can start getting really juicy plot, and complex character modivations, so if people watched one episode and wrote this show off, especially if they like the main show, they should have known better, and known to trust Adam and Eddy. So as I said, I'm not sure to whom you believe this show failed. Maybe if I understand that better, I could understand why you don't think they would put the characters from this show on the main show, even if it only goes one season. As far as people who never watched this show, if Lizard for example appears on the main show, they will be none the wiser that she is an existing character from Wonderland, so it won't make them feel they are getting a character from a failed show. Also, I'm probably over-analysing what you said, as you say your speaking from an out-of-context standpoint, but I do think that context is important, especially in a case of a main show and a spin off, because for all we know this was a master plan to just expand the world and add more characters for those that wanted more, and they only want it to go one season, and if that is the case, then they haven't really failed at all. And with that I'm going to sign off, because now I'm starting to sound like a character from Alice and Wonderland. XD

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    • Well, I don't think the situation in here is really representative of the whole fanbase because taking care of a wikia or following it assiduously means we're all very committed fans, so perhaps many of us would watch it anyways just out of curiosity to learn more about the OUAT multiverse (as I did initially). Out of here, though, I can tell you most of my OUAT-fan friends have dropped Wonderland at some point, so I'm afraid the general consensus inside the fanbase is not that high. And that won't change even though, for instance, I keep telling my friends it's getting better and better – I was Wonderland Skeptic #1, so if even I am warming up they should try and trust me. Add it to the poor ratings and you get the picture. :/

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    • I love the show.

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    • Ok I like and dislike a few things Utter and Cooldude said.

      Cooldude, no one knows about middle earth, and Narnia is not Disney-like in anyway. Before Disney (which is who owns ABC and OUAT) even attempts to think about suggesting to go there, I think they would cover their basics first. We haven't seen Jasmine/Aladdin, we haven't seen Mary Poppins, Cruella, or a whole lot of Maleficent, what about Madam Mim/Merlin, what of Mogli and his Jungle book, will that introduce the Lion King?

      My point is there are so many RICH Disney stories to explore, why would you even think they would stray so far into actually making a OUaT in Middle Earth? or in Narnia or those others you suggested?

      My thought for you to think of is, Disney will not stray so far from the Disney tree.

      Utter, your comments on OUaTiW are very negative, no wonder they have low ratings, if fans like you are bashing a OUAT tangent. We're supposed to support these shows so they last, not give into .."well the ratings are low, thats it. Its done for".

      I happen to like...to REALLY like this new, twist of a show. In fact, I was more impressed with their character developments for Jafar and Anastasia then the ones for Ursula and Ariel.

      The actress that plays Anastasia is an AMAZING actress, but some people are so caught up with comparing her to Regina. That actress is young, and pulls off a pretty great b*tch of a Queen, yet you can see she's got SOME vulnerability. That is hard to pull off. I don't know many young women who are that couragious and fearless to behave/act like that girl can.

      People are too picky and busy nitpicking every little thing they cannot enjoy a well-presented show like this. Its very sad. We don't get very many shows like this and people want to nitpick? I for one support both the shows, and care not one bit about the ratings. For all I care, I wouldn't mind they keep the show running just for me to watch. 1 viewer.

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    • ^Dude, Utter's not really bashing the show...as far as I know I think she likes it, she's just making a point, and a valid one at that. With low ratings, the logical conclusion is to ditch everything, because unfortunately, in the real world, with one viewer, a network is unlikely to continue a TV show or its' characters. Sadly (because hey, I enjoy OUaTiW too), with the amount of views OUaTiW is getting, while it's not just one, it's still pretty low for ABC and still therefore unlikely they'll do anything. 

      It's unfortunate, but that's how it is. It's the most logical conclusion on ABC's part.

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    • Raelizflo wrote:
      Ok I like and dislike a few things Utter and Cooldude said.

      Cooldude, no one knows about middle earth, and Narnia is not Disney-like in anyway. Before Disney (which is who owns ABC and OUAT) even attempts to think about suggesting to go there, I think they would cover their basics first. We haven't seen Jasmine/Aladdin, we haven't seen Mary Poppins, Cruella, or a whole lot of Maleficent, what about Madam Mim/Merlin, what of Mogli and his Jungle book, will that introduce the Lion King?

      My point is there are so many RICH Disney stories to explore, why would you even think they would stray so far into actually making a OUaT in Middle Earth? or in Narnia or those others you suggested?

      My thought for you to think of is, Disney will not stray so far from the Disney tree.

      Utter, your comments on OUaTiW are very negative, no wonder they have low ratings, if fans like you are bashing a OUAT tangent. We're supposed to support these shows so they last, not give into .."well the ratings are low, thats it. Its done for".

      I happen to like...to REALLY like this new, twist of a show. In fact, I was more impressed with their character developments for Jafar and Anastasia then the ones for Ursula and Ariel.

      The actress that plays Anastasia is an AMAZING actress, but some people are so caught up with comparing her to Regina. That actress is young, and pulls off a pretty great b*tch of a Queen, yet you can see she's got SOME vulnerability. That is hard to pull off. I don't know many young women who are that couragious and fearless to behave/act like that girl can.

      People are too picky and busy nitpicking every little thing they cannot enjoy a well-presented show like this. Its very sad. We don't get very many shows like this and people want to nitpick? I for one support both the shows, and care not one bit about the ratings. For all I care, I wouldn't mind they keep the show running just for me to watch. 1 viewer.

      First off, I also like the show, but let's not forget it's a side story of the main show. So if Eddy and Adam want to give us a whole bunch of one season side story shows, I am happy with that. And I personally feel ABC does have a vested interest in Once Upon A Time, due to them liking Eddy and Adam, liking the cult favorite stadus Lost had, liking they they are the only network that can have Disney references, and like the amount of extra material they can make (like books, comic books, etc.) that turns an extra profit. As far as your Disney first thought, I agree and disagree. For one, we've already had non Disney stories, like Greek Myths that are not Hercules, and Little Red Riding Hood. Second, I think you missunderstand, I was merely talking about spin off shows, I want to see Mary Poppins, and Mogwi, and Cruella, and Alladin just as much as you do, but they do not deseve there own show, so they will be featured on the main Once show, or maybe they will be featured on a spin off, Jafar's in Wonderland after all. But they do not come from unique worlds that could be there own spin off. And I think that covers everything that you were saying to me.

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    • Raelizflo wrote: Utter, your comments on OUaTiW are very negative, no wonder they have low ratings, if fans like you are bashing a OUAT tangent. We're supposed to support these shows so they last, not give into .."well the ratings are low, thats it. Its done for".

      I happen to like...to REALLY like this new, twist of a show. In fact, I was more impressed with their character developments for Jafar and Anastasia then the ones for Ursula and Ariel.

      I actually love Wonderland; you're ignoring/twisting my words. I actually said several times in this thread that my whole "it will piss people off to put Wonderland characters on OUaT" line was speaking purely economically. It is very presumptuous to assume that everyone who's a fan of OUaT must love Wonderland, and that everyone is going to want to see those characters on the main show if it fails. It's also kind of crazy to think that we should only say positive things about it.... this is the Internet, it's where people go to vent, especially about stuff they love. But, I digress.

      I would love to see Jafar on OUaT, I just wonder if that's what's best for the show.

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    • I think Jafar would make a nice edition to the show, but if they could pull it off is another story. I would like to see a bit more Agrabah in OUAT as well, so if they could find a way of exploring Jafar or any other character from that world in ONCE without delving TOO much into the events of Wonderland I think it might work. 

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    • I think it could be well-done as long as those viewers who haven't watched any Wonderland don't feel left out because of that. That's what loses viewers.

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    • If the spin-off has to be cancelled after the first season, I really hope the characters will be merged into OUaT, especially Anastasia and the Knave. To me, they are the most interesting characters. There is so much to discover about their background stories and huge potential for them to evolve. I really want to see them in their next adventures !!!

      As of the idea of running another mini-series, it had never occured to me, but I love it ! And I would simply suggest Once Upon a Time in Agrabah. We could see more of Jafar, who was also a really interesting character, there could be Aladdin and Jasmine, that fans have requested, and Prince Eric, who said he was sailing that way.

      Whatever happens, I just wish that we would still see those characters. And yes, I love the Knave ^^

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    • Regardless, I hope they release a teaser/trailer/sneak peek of the next episode soon. I'm starving.

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    • Why is everyone so worried about the show being cancelled. The writers have said that they a complete story they want to tell. And they will tell it. I'm fine if the show finishes not cancels after this season. I rather that than it being abruptly be cancelled during season 2.

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    • GothicNarcissus wrote:
      Regardless, I hope they release a teaser/trailer/sneak peek of the next episode soon. I'm starving.

      Yeah, me too. You can't even find set pictures...

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    • It seems to me that Wonderland may not be canceled, but just be ended (as in the story they are telling is done). The last episode of the season is titled "And They Lived..." with the "..." implying "happily ever after". If that is the case, I think Wonderland will not come back, however, that being said, I could still see other spinoffs like "Once Upon A Time In Oz" coming out in the future and I also think the main and recurring characters (or at least some of them) on this show will guest star on the main show at some point.

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    • 68.228.183.195
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